i love twisted stories(without a fluffy stuff, and more raw emotions), bad guys ,twisted guys it is always welcome you know! it is really diferent from the others novels and have thier own appeal, im waiting for the next chapters! btw the art is amazing!
Degraman: Act I. Vincent & Cassel ~ otome demo
A downloadable game for Windows, macOS, and Linux
11/10/2019: Demo is here! The full version is supposed to be NSFW. The demo is not
Twitter - shortreads
Tumblr - longreads
Patreon - support us
You live a normal life. You listen to your mother like a good daughter. You go to College like a good student. You take care of stray cats like a good Samaritan. Life is measured, dull, and monotonous, but calm and predictable. You always know that tomorrow will be the same as it is today. The same as it was yesterday...
But all of that is gone in a moment, washed away in a stream of crystal clear water.
The beginning of your new life is marked by the appearance of mysterious kidnappers. They don't ask for your permission, nor do they care if you're prepared. Not before dragging you into an unknown world full of strange, incomprehensible, mystical, and sometimes terrible things.
But you are not afraid, for these same very people are ready to protect you with their lives. Extremely attractive, they give all of their attention to you. You're important to them. You're special. What's more, you ARE one of them; superhumans waging an invisible war for the salvation of all mankind.
Life is awash with color now that you are no longer an ordinary person who is invisible to the eyes of the world...now that you're his Savior...
But what if none of that were true?
What if you were still the same gray figure the entire world saw you as?
What if you were just a bargaining chip in a game for depraved superhumans? A game with no rules. A game in which every mistake leads to an inevitable and cruel death. A game in which the correct path is not always obvious.
Only by straddling the line between evil and greater evil are you able to snatch your chance at survival.
But is it worth it..?
Full Game Features
- 21 Chapters
- 15+ Endings
- 12+ Original Music Tracks
- 80+ CGs
- 30+ BGs
- 2 romanceable love interests, and 6 side characters with whom you can flirt and perhaps even have an affair
- The possibility of completing the game without romancing anyone
- 10+ hours of gameplay
- Adult sexual content
- Secret characters and other plot twists that all rely on your choices
- Additional routes, romances, and stories will be coming later
Feedback or bugreport
If you have any feedback, which you don't want to be visible for everyone
you found a bug - plz write directly to us using this form (anonymous)
Click download now to get access to the following files:
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Thank yo uso much! (´｡• ω •｡`)
We will try not to dissapoint you. Such a high evaluation makes us blush
It is so interesting.OMG I AM WAITING FOR IT
This is really, really interesting!
I feel like I can't trust any of the guys. They all seem to have ulterior motives, but maybe I'll find out their true intentions in the future chapters. I can't wait till the next update. 😁
Thank you so much!
We do our best to release the game, but it will be available only in Q3 2020 (if we are not dramatically mistaken) (´｡• ω •｡`)
At first I was like, jeez, this demo's long (not that I was complaining) and then when it ended I was SO HOOKED. Thanks to everyone for the obvious hard work (and for the future hard work!) I can't wait to play the full version!
Thank you so much! For your warm words. We're doing our bets to bring the full version as soon as it possible (≧ω≦)
I just finished the demo and it's incredible, the music, the story has left me wanting to play the whole game,please keep going, you're doing a fantastic job!
Im officially hooked,
Brilliant effort so far, im a huge fan of darker vns and really it was a pleasure to be so uncomfortable right off the bat, to watch as the momentary glossy vermeer of otome is ripped away to prove something more insidious- i will wait with anticipation to see this story unfold.
my sincere kudos and admiration to you all working on this, it is shaping up to be a beautiful yet harrowing experience.
Oh, thanks for such a wonderful feedback! (｡◕‿‿◕｡)
We are very glad that you appreciated the darkness in Degramen. We hope, you will be the person who will plunge completely into the gloomy world of quansie with pleasure (¬‿¬)
Great demo, really enjoyed every bit of it! Game's artstyle, atmosphere and mood are so unique and interesting. But i wonder, are you going to release your game (when it will be finished of course) on Steam or here on Itch.io? Or maybe some other platform? (Sorry if someone already asked this question)
Потрясающая демка. Персонажи цепляют своей оригинальностью. Романтическая ветвь раскрывает персонажей не как шаблоны, а как глубокие интересные личности. С нетерпением жду полную версию. Не пожалею никаких денег.
Разработчикам сил, удачи и вдохновения)
Ох, огроменное спасибо что так полюбили Деграмена! Надеюсь, что мы оправдаем ваши ожидания (ﾉ◕ヮ◕)ﾉ*:･ﾟ✧
This is absolutely unbelievable.
Amazing graphics, an excellent soundtrack and an exciting story, what else is needed for complete happiness.
Great work, excellent visual novel!
the best demo game i played so far even if i couldnt afford the full game it will remain as my fav game i really love the art style and the atmospher playing the game it reminded me of how i draw
Thank you! We hope you can afford the full game and you'll like more than the demo (´｡• ᵕ •｡`)
i'm in love, the art was beautiful and the characters are amazing, i need more of this story, i can't explain how much i loved it
We are happy, that you liked our game so much!
We are hit to the heart by your adoring and enthusiastic words
(´• ω •`) ♡
This is madness, but it's fun and I like it, despite it perhaps not being my preferred...um. Type of premise? The music and the artwork are really nice (pity that Vincent's lovely butt doesn't fit on the screen, though XD). I think Sebastian is my favourite guy so far. He's so pretty and has such lovely hair. And he doesn't do anything. GOOD! XD Because, honestly, the other guys getting so handsy and stuff was a bit overwhelming. If it were me, I would be hiding behind Vincent. XD But I wouldn't mind getting to be the Sleeping Beauty's cuddly toy, I suppose, as long as he doesn't try to eat my hair.
Thank you so such for a humorous and incendiary comment.
Our mood has improved thanks to your words ＼(≧▽≦)／
In the full version maybe the other guys will not overwhelm you so much and you will be able to protect your personal space (っ˘ω˘ς)
Wait. Will this be a commercial game? If so, is there any estimated price?
Hello. The game will be commercial, that's for sure. But, unfortunately, we cannot name the price right now, even the range. Mostly because this is our first project. The price will be known up to the release date, which will be Q2-Q3 2020
Downloading and playing this demo today was the best decision I made! I got so hooked on the exquisite art and the music I was so sad when the demo ended! I absolutely love the plot of the game and was so shock and super pleasantly surprised when the shirtless scene moved to a more dark tone. While there are room for improvements in the fluidity of the first chapter in the writing it definetly didn't didn't take way from the plot, the ART is AMAZING, i love how vivid all the characters are and their personalities are so charming. I don't know if it has said before but I will love to financially support this project either on Patreon or Kickstarter, can't wait to see all the amazing work you guys will put into this project in the future! Will be closely following updates.
Oh, we are so glad that we were able to seduce you to download the demo! (⌒ω⌒)
It's nice to hear that you liked the plot twist!
Perhaps, in the demo the text is somewhat crumpled. But in the full version, we will try to improve it. (￣^￣)ゞ
Our artist is happy that you so highly appreciated his work. (ノ*ﾟ▽ﾟ*)
Thank you for accepting our characters so friendly. These are our favorites and we are glad that readers also treat him with sympathy.
WOW! We did not even hope that at such a stage of the project we may receive financial support, therefore we were embarrassed to leave a reference to the patron. But, to our surprise, you and a couple of people have taken this initiative. Therefore, we overcome the constraint and added a link to the patron at the top of the page. Thank you very much for your kind words, for a pinch of criticism and for your willingness to help ＼(＾▽＾)／
It's visible that enormous work has been done. I usually don't play demo(even if I download them) but this time I'm really happy that I decided to try it. The story was amazing - it's not your typical cliche harem game. I would call it a thriller otome game :) . I think this project has a HUGE potential because the demo was really brilliant. I really wanna know how did you manage to make your characters so alive - each of them is unique. I think this game might become one of my favorite otome in the future. I will definitely keep an eye on this project!
Our heart already began to beat more often, it was so pleasant to read your review! (⁄ ⁄•⁄ω⁄•⁄ ⁄)
We are glad that you saw the work and soul that we put into the demo.
And we really appreciate that you mentioned our approach to the script ;)
Very nice that you have become so empathize with the heroes, knowing them quite a bit! We hope that with a close acquaintance, you will love them! (っ˘ω˘ς)
Thank you again for such a high evaluation! We will try not to disappoint you in the future! ┌(ಠ_ಠ)┘
This game... This a game! It's not a game - it's a GAME! I first played it many months ago, when the demo version came out very raw and had only one language (the language of creators). It grew on my eyes, changed and got better from month to month. On some game moments I dropped tears, on others I laughed for several hours - they were so funny or close for me.
What did it do to me the first time? Characters sprites and description of the plot. I especially liked at that time three guys: Ian, Victor and Ragnar. After some time, I fell more and more in love with one of them - Ian. This minor character conquered me from head to toe and everything between. If someone ask me about ideal man - I'll show them Ian and describe his character and his thoughts about the world and life. After all, I believe and guess that he is tough and unsociable only from the outside, and inside he is an angel consisting of passion and love. hehe
I'm really looking forward to the full release of this game and very much hope and wait for the appearance of the continuation, which will be my charm - Ian.
P.S. Also I like very much Ragnar. I love huge red-haired men in bathrobes who smoke something forbidden. XD and Victor-pierced thin fingers - artist-boys are also my type.
I think we know who you are) you often wrote us comments on the site in our country. Thank you, that you supported us here too! ♡ (´｡• ω •｡`) ♡
Your kind words have been inspiring and motivating us for so long.
Thanks for your feedback, the novel has become better and I hope that you will be delighted with the full version! (((o (*ﾟ▽ﾟ*)o)))
Degraman is my favorite novell now. Very interesting and beautiful characters. During the passage of the game, empathize with the main character. I really look forward to the release of new chapters.
Thank you! It is so joyful and pleasant to read such kind words! We will try very hard to please you with the release of the full version as soon as possible!
Loved the demo. The art is beautiful and the music fits so well! The writing is good too. Really look forward to more news about the game and its release. Thank you for sharing this! <3
Hurray! thank you for writing kind words and positively rated our demo!
Every warm word addressed to us-we appreciate and inspire to work (*≧ω≦*)
Ha, I went in blindly without reading the synopsis and got caught off guard by the tonal shift... oof, that was good!
I thought this would be going in the direction of a standard harem fanservice fest, but my expectations were subverted entirely. My impressions of Vincent switched too- he's a doll. <3
I will be contrarian here and say that I adore love interest options that are terrible, wicked, selfish, manipulative people (Dead Wishes, Demonheart, Boyfriend to Death, Till Death Do Us Part).
The "true love" plot device works really well because it contrasts with how underhanded and deceitful the guys come off. They can't just rip her to bits or force themselves on her to get what they want, but actually have to both help her survive and earn her genuine favor. Especially now that she sees through the BS.
Though I do hope that the MC will have the option in the full game to be just as use-y and cruel herself.
My favorites are Mark and Victor and Ian ~
Whoa, thanks! We're so glad we could be more than a harem for you (ﾉ◕ヮ◕)ﾉ*
We appreciate that you enjoyed our twist (⌒ω⌒)
In the full version, MC will have the opportunity to be ... quite a bit more angry and very manipulative (after all MC has advantage - her abilities are very useful )
Thank you for saying who are your favorites) this is very interesting information!
The lore and stuff seemed really cool, the art is really nice but the story is... Honestly I don't even have the words. Maybe I could find interest if the MC wasn't so annoying and it wasn't so terribly written? Like the wording and all is good, the potential is there but it's impossibly boring and constantly makes 0 sense.
The MC is always agreeing with everyone, even when they're contradicting each other. Victor is making so much sense, even though she thought the same about Vincent like 10 min ago and they were wanting completely opposite things to happen. Does she not have a mind of her own? I get being indecisive, trust me but this has really just been frustrating. I read in other comments that you plan to add more options, but it just doesn't seem fixable how much thought text there is and all the while she still seems impossibly thoughtless. Like she thinks herself in circles and never seems to get anywhere beyond "EVERYONE IS SO RIGHT!!"
And HOW would she even know if Vincent is right that without her ability to amplify powers, none of them would even look at her? She doesn't know any of them and since meeting her they've all thrown themselves at her, so how can she know the dude is right? How can she come to the conclusion that he's honest? She has no proof of her own abilities, so why is she like "OH random angry dude has been nothing but mean to me but he's mad so he must be telling the truth and be so right!" Nah, man.
Also they're so ridiculously inappropriate with her, like all of them, shamelessly so that the fact she could not suspect SOMETHING is going on, falling for it, and still tryna be like the typical, clueless, innocent anime MC who is totally oblivious to everyone's advances really just doesn't work out. It makes no sense. NO SENSE. You have to decide whether she's open to this whole everyone coming onto her and knows they're coming on to her OR is she totally clueless and shy? Because she seems to go back and forth and I think I have whiplash.
THEN, the whole storming off without thinking only to be convinced it was stupid even though she has already been told ex-machina thing is like... Ugh. There is an actual choice near the beginning for her to decide she's staying there because "I'm in danger" so there is no way she storms off and then is surprised later when Vincent tells her that she could die. Like... Yes, they said that only 50 times, I get you're confused but you don't SUDDENLY start caring that your life is in danger because the mean dude followed you and continued to be as mean as when he initially caused you to run away. Maybe a different catalyst is needed in that situation because "my feelings are hurt after enduring two days of Vincent's insults" is kinda a really shaky plot device at this point.
Which leads me to otome trope/plot device cliche #1: She has to be in love with dude to amplify his abilities. That's like... So not even necessary. I can see them vying for her attention for the mere fact she can only amplify one person at a time. How the heck does her ability even tell she's in love with someone? That's some serious Disney princess insanity, right there. Like the characters try to give these scientific explanations but lo and behold the MAGIC OF TRUE LOVE! Seems like it really doesn't fit, it's just there to try and push a romantic plot, which... seems super unnecessary, they can try to use her without the magical love thing in fine print there at the bottom and on top of that.. How do they even KNOW THAT? Vincent says there have only been a handful like her, how do you scientifically explain an ability activated by "love". I mean if we're talking endorphins here, I'ma go out on a limb here and say that I don't think it matters much how much you love someone, if you're fighting for your life against some time altering monster thing... I don't think your brain is going to be producing much dopamine or any other hormones relevant to love and affection, but I'm not a neurologist so who knows.
I get this is a demo, but it needs a lot of work, Imo. I mean there's some potential but for the most part, I don't really expect to be wowed. But the art is really well done. Super polished, the lore seems super interesting but beyond a shallow smut oriented story line, I'm not entirely sure what the actual story is supposed to be about. They're going to fight some Atlids! To what end, I'm not sure, but I'm pretty sure that's what's happening. Probably gonna fight them naked too. I'm not sure.
Thank you so much for your feedback. Well done for writing so much practical and useful information for us. It would be disapointing if a player who did not like the demo would silently delete it. And we believe that without feedback we will not get better (/ *ω*)/
The demo was not intended to be a complete work in its own right. Our goal was to show as much content as possible. And, perhaps, generate questions, answers to which the player will be able to find later.
I really am wishing the best for it, and hopefully there is a difference, I generally only post comments when I think the project is worth it. I DO know I'm probably harsh and probably come off mean so I'm really glad that you aren't discouraged. I do plan to keep an eye on this project too, so I have my fingers crossed that you guys are able to deliver. =]
You're not as savvy as you think you are so maybe you need to cool your jets a bit and realise the one who might be missing something is you.
Seems pretty obvious to me that she doesn't "know" Vincent is right. She believes him because she has low self esteem. It's referenced that she's never had any friends or lovers, she's always been alone. Even her mum doesn't talk to her. So it's very easy for her to believe what he says, easy to believe that people don't like her for herself because nobody ever has before.
God, at least pay attention to what you're complaining about if you're going to launch into some long crappy rant.
Also yeah it's pretty obvious you aren't a neurologist. You think people don't fall in love in warzones? In life or death situations? Think again.
Needlessly snarky, yes. Also,
"And HOW would she even know if Vincent is right that without her ability to amplify powers, none of them would even look at her? She doesn't know any of them and since meeting her they've all thrown themselves at her, so how can she know the dude is right?"
"Also they're so ridiculously inappropriate with her, like all of them, shamelessly so that the fact she could not suspect SOMETHING is going on, falling for it, and still tryna be like the typical, clueless, innocent anime MC who is totally oblivious to everyone's advances really just doesn't work out."
These two statements contradict each other. Is she an idiot for thinking they her or is she an idiot for believing they might not like her?
"They might not like her" AND "He's totally right" are two very different ideas. I absolutely think she'd definitely have doubts that they would like her, but that doesn't mean that everyone who talks to her is right and honest because they feed into her suspicions. Which is where it gets really tricky and confusing. Because she monologues it all as "he told me something I don't understand and have 0 evidence for so he must be super right and honest despite the fact that someone is obviously lying. And yes, definitely snarky, because that's how I am. If I'm toxic, you'll just have to deal with it, I never denied, in fact I already said I was and apologized. Does that mean it will change, no, absolutely not. But thank you anyway for your response.
You sure sound like one of those "brutally honest" people that pull this kind of BS more for the brutality than the honesty. And for someone so critical of others you're making a real effort to look the other way from critique towards you.
Also, "I apologize for this behavior that I will deliberately continue" is a complete non-apology. You aren't sorry.
I'm not sorry for who I am, no. Sucks that you don't like it, you went out of your way to read my comment and be offended. I am my worst critic. Absolutely no one is telling me anything I've not said to myself. You can all be nice about your critiques, I'm going to be me, it's probably meaner than it needs to be, maybe it will change, maybe it won't.
I agree with Cjindel. You can also give a decent, respectul review without being rude and just coming off as an angry gamer who couldn't find their specific requirements meant in this specific game. Yes, there's room for improvement but is a demo? is not the final product, and while I am always rooting for feedback whether is positive AND negative on any type of games to help the creators improve, you need to learn to communicate your opinion without being snarky.
Falling in love in warzones is not the same as needing a chemical response to do something specific in the heat of a moment. I've already mentioned that. The needing to be in love thing is annoying and not necessary for the plot at all. If they want to add it, it only takes away from the plot in my opinion. They can fight over and be desperate for her attention in an attempt to use her for her abilities without this unnecessary layer. It seems like a huge stretch and sure if you think that it works that's your opinion which I personally didn't ask for, maybe they want to know, but I don't and your comment on MY comment isn't warranted. BUT thank you for sharing anyway. I apologize if my self expression and opinion offended you. That doesn't change my opinion unfortunately.
From what I played there were multiple opportunities to rebuff or criticize the guys.
With Ian specifically I remember you can be bored of his long-windedness, openly suspicious that he's doing so on purpose, or angry because you're sure he's doing it on purpose. Or civil, because maybe he's actually going somewhere with his rambling.
I also remember having the choice to not humor most of the advances because I already had a guy in mind. And apparently we'll be getting more ways to react.
I think the love trope works well due to it preventing them from swarming her like a bunch of piranhas. Because they tried exactly that. And now that she's aware just want something from her, it's no longer viable to just be the one that flatters her the most.
If it were something tangible like her "eat her heart" or "take her virginity" then I wouldn't put it past them to turn into absolute animals to be the one that gets it from her whether she consents or not.
Even if it were something intangible like "she knows where (special item) is" or "she can sense the presence of Altids" then they could easily threaten to throw her to the wolves, starve her, or harm her if she doesn't help.
Getting her to genuinely love them is the one thing they can't force, and their shortcut of tricking her into falling in love is gone now that Vincent spilled the beans.
I'd say that the "none of them would even look at her" comment sounded believable from Vincent at the time BECAUSE of how inappropriate and suspiciously forward they were all being. It's at least one of the only things she's been hearing that makes the most sense, since Ian had been making absolutely none. It can't be chalked up as a quansie thing either, since Cass wasn't acting a fool. Nor Ian or Vincent.
Indeed. Which seems weirder still when she is suddenly like "oml they're all so right." out of no where. You do have options not to humour their advances, but she still seems to randomly ogle them even if you choose to shut them down. It all seems weird to me, like it really just doesn't flow and the main character goes back and forth ALOT, in the absence of options, perhaps. Which I AM hoping that this is something that does get fixed when more options are added, but it is something that really needs to change for the sake of character consistency.
As I've said before, the love trope just isn't necessary. They have these characters attempting to justify and explain the science of this world which is what I love so much about the world building they've done(confusing plot aside). The world seems cool and they're implementing interesting rules for their world in which I do not believe an ability activated by "love" just doesn't seem to fit. They could be wrong, there is obviously a lot they don't know, yes and yet that seems to me like all the more reason that them knowing something so obscure as "love is the key to this ability" seems so out of place. The ability itself just doesn't really seem to NEED that. A fear response even would honestly work better or something at least a little more tangible, maybe not even a choice at all where the ability responds on it's own. The fact that only one person can benefit from the ability SHOULD be enough for them to want to get her attention, not necessary "love" but proximity and an attempt to win her affection so she will either CHOOSE to spend more time with them and help them or they will benefit by mere proximity and familiarity. I don't see how it would be possible to really gauge love especially in a life or death situation where it would matter. Harming and starving and so on would work no matter what, if I were honest. They can hold her captive and torture her and hope she developed Stockholm syndrome if they were really going to go all out. It's simply too hard a thing to keep track of, people experience things much too differently even for this to work out. It just doesn't fit for me.
And I absolutely agree that she would probably definitely be swayed by the comment. But she monologues it with such finality, as if she has some reason to believe anything the dude that kidnapped her says. "He's right." Not "He may be right.", "he's probably right.", "Is that true?". It's "Vincent is mean, but he's honest." That seems like the biggest fricken leap. He's done nothing but say hurtful things on purpose, regardless of their relevance or accuracy, so the massive jump to "He's right. Vincent is mean but he's honest." is jarring. She could at least have some doubt, no the guys don't have a genuine interest in her, but that doesn't mean he is right or honest. Her abilities are entirely foreign to her, so taking his revelation as truth and honesty just because some dudes she doesn't know are stripping in front of her doesn't seem like something she'd be doing if you've previously played a skeptical MC especially. And that she sees him as honest and not trying to throw the others under the bus to win her favour with a different, equally deceptive tactic is just a little frustrating. WHY would she trust him at all?
I'm not reading this wall LOL
Take a nap.
Edit: I've said my piece and know that this will end up going in circles. You're way too proud of your toxicity to hold an actual discussion.
"Probably gonna fight them naked too. I'm not sure."
Lol, like can you be anymore toxic? I understand that you have the right to express yourself online but it sounded like you were just trying to find any reason to complain about the story instead of trying to at least understand MC's character, her circumstances and her background. I really hate to participate in comment wars like that but I just couldn't help myself and needed to speak up. The tone of your comments and your complaints sounded super toxic and full of prejudice. The most ridiculous part of your comment was when you were trying to find a scientific explanation of MC's ability, "activated by "love"". X)) Like, are you for real?!))) Do you realize that the story is happening in a fantasy world where most of the things can't be explained so easily and sometimes don't have any explanation at all? Next time you write a comment, please, try not to humiliate yourself.
Every world has rules, a world that sets up it's rules and then just breaks them itself isn't worth the time or effort to read about. There are anomalies, there are things we can't explain, but they do always have explanations. Even in worlds where magic is wildly used, there are always explanations and limits to the powers. This world has spent the time trying to scientifically explain the Atlids and how they interact with the world. Even the history lessons pertained to the science and rules of the world the MC is living in. If you are trying to scientifically explain the abilities of a group of people, even despite how special the MC supposedly is, you can't just disregard the rules of the world without explanation. If they plan to add an explanation as to how the love thing fits into the science of their world, I would completely support it. But it doesn't as is. If they want to be like "we don't know how the ability works" fine. A "we don't fully understand the nature of this ability" is totally acceptable. But "It only works if you love someone and we know that somehow because on of the other- roughly 5 of you- somehow confirmed this." really just doesn't work for me. I love that they want to make an interesting story, the world is fascinating, the art is pretty, Idk how into the story I'll be. It has the potential to make me incredibly uncomfortable and I won't lie, I skipped through the stripping scene because that's just no my style. BUT I am very interested in the world and want to play the game to understand it.
My snark is mostly just a way to point out how ridiculous some of this stuff is. When they do weird stuff with no connection or explanation, things that are unnecessary and have no ties to the plot or story line, honestly it's just annoying. When a writer dives into wordy junk for no benefit. You can disagree that some of this stuff is unnecessary, but there seems, to me, to be a lot of things that don't benefit the story at all. If they were meant to have some impact, they're doing it wrong, that's important. So things like the strip thing, that makes sense, it could've been done differently but it has it's purpose, to show how far these people would go in order to use her. So I'm not complaining about it but I will definitely take a snipe because it's a little extreme and I think it's funny. With the tone of the rest, I can see how it'd be negative, definitely. It was honestly just a joke(ill-intended as it may have been). However the love thing, it serves no real purpose. It doesn't fit, it takes away from the plot as it doesn't follow the current rules of the world as they've set up so far. If they can't come up with a way to explain it into the world they're building it's just kinda there. For no reason. Not fitting.
You can argue that's why they're pretending to be interested in her. The reality is, they don't NEED a reason beyond she has an ability they could take advantage of. It's easier to catch flies with honey. It's easier to convince her she loves them and would do anything for them. Love doesn't HAVE to be part of her ability for that to be the most desirable and smartest course of action. They're already manipulative enough to want to use her if it IS a requirement, and if it isn't then you give yourself so much more room to work if you take out the requirement. So while Victor doesn't think he can convince her to love him anymore because she saw all the bugs, there are other ways for him to gain her cooperation as long as she stays. He can still try to manipulate her by gaining her trust. The other guys can still try to seduce her AND also try to get her cooperation through other means. Scaring her, tricking her, pretending to be her friend. It's honestly a thousand times better, even for the plot if it's not a thing.
"Every world has rules, a world that sets up it's rules and then just breaks them itself isn't worth the time or effort to read about."
So you decided to scientifically explain the the rules of Degraman's world from the demo which is 5 chapters long? =) Wow, nice approach) Many things in the world where we actually live still don't have an explanation - like we still don't know whether God exists and if we came from monkeys or Adam and Eve. Yet you still try to explain the rules of a fantasy world from the demo?)
"If they plan to add an explanation as to how the love thing fits into the science of their world, I would completely support it."
That is just how the things work in that world between quansies. They are unusual creatures with super-powers so their romantic relationships might have their own unusual rules. Why does it need some scientific explanation if many things in the real world can't be explained by science?
"My snark is mostly just a way to point out how ridiculous some of this stuff is. When they do weird stuff with no connection or explanation, things that are unnecessary and have no ties to the plot or story line, honestly it's just annoying. "
I think that in fact it was you who couldn't understand the "connection" :) If you weren't so preconceived and narrow-minded, you would see that most of the things made sense.
And you know what's really ridiculous? How hypocritical you are: writing that you wish all the best for this project and that you're glad that the creators aren't discouraged, yet trying every possible way to offend their game and to discourage them.
If you're trying to sound smart, at least try not to contradict yourself.
Good thing I never asked for you opinion. If you want to praise the game, do so. It has some very interesting aspects. I just sat through 5 minutes of explanation on how quansies are a thing, how they interact with the world, how they interact with history, how they interact with one another and Atlids to have it thrown out the window in favour of the all consuming magic that is true love's kiss. So yeah, I'm trying to examine the world as it has so far been presented to me. I'm not into games for the shallow love plots or how many characters I can get undressed. I like to explore and discover and experience the fantasy worlds. Fantasy worlds are still bound by laws of that reality, otherwise there are no consequences and no stakes. If you're going to start springing ridiculous nonsense on the reader, nothing in the story will get taken seriously. We won't be invested in the characters or concerned about the choices because they don't matter, all consequences can be magicked away. If that's your thing, fine, it's not mine, so I mentioned it.
You're opinion is entirely irrelevant to me, but thanks for commenting, I guess? If you have issues with the things I'm saying, really, just maybe don't read it. It's not for you, it doesn't pertain to you, and the devs have already responded. It seems resolved to me. They responded positively, and sure maybe it's just to save face or how ever you want to justify it but it's kinda between them and I, right? Though I do appreciate your digital white knighting, it's good that people are ready to defend them. I'm also sure they appreciate it and once again really not necessary, since I'm 100% willing to talk it out with them in a softer tone if they are interested in my opinions any further. Not seeing the connection is relevant to the creation because either the connection isn't clear enough or I really see how you're drawing these connections. It just seems like a stretch to me for whatever reason (and you can continue to attack my intelligence, I'm not trying to do anything but give feedback about my personal experience) I'm not trying to draw a connection that isn't there just so I can like the story. I want to try and figure it all out, I want to know what's happening before it happens and be able to have theories about what's what and why, because that is how I play games. Maybe it's not your style to question everything, that's fine. Maybe you just want a storyless fluff piece, that's ok too. It's not what I want, I want something that makes me think and wonder.
If the devs don't want to make that sort of game, they don't have to. They won't be able to please everyone, it's just reality. If I end up being disappointed, then I do, but I'm interested in the game and I want to like it, so I gave them the issues that would make me dislike the game. It's not up to you to decide how I post my thoughts. If they have an issue with it, they can contact me. It's not for you. I have no problem apologizing to people directly involved, you are not. Unless you are. Are you a writer? Are you participating in the creation of this game and is your function relevant to the information I've provided? If not, then... Don't read my rant? No one asked you to come be offended for someone else.
If your concern is that they will change something you personally do not want changed, leave your own comment about the things you did like that contradict my own opinions and let them decide. You liking the story doesn't change that there are aspects that just don't fit the world building they've done that don't have a big enough impact on the plot to be necessary. If they don't care about it, then they don't and I just won't play it. You're making a huge deal about it because it was worded in a way you didn't like, even though you have no part in it. If the issue is that I'm just too stupid, why waste the time responding when it's so obvious that the connection is just there and the science is so sound that no one should have to second guess? If you're so desperate to have some weird true-love plot to satisfy your fantasies, maybe just say that instead of trying to justify it with some mystical garbage that doesn't fit with the establish rules thus far mentioned in the story. That's a valid thing, I'm speaking to my own preference. I'd rather it make sense as opposed to forcing a romantic connection between two pixel-people. I prefer the relationships in games to come together in a natural way. Not "you have to fall in love with us for it to work." and now it's on her mind and still doesn't make any sense, yay super powers. Opinion, surprise, people have those. They aren't all the same. They might conflict with yours, it's what makes people great and interesting. If you can't handle conflicting ones, stay off the internet.
I think it'd be better if you were looking at this story not as one based 100% on realism, but rather as a mechanism with specifically chosen decisions made to create certain emotions in the reader, within the writer's own tolerances.
The main reason why love is what amplifies a dude's abilities is because the alternatives too dark. And the writers don't want to go there, for whatever reason. Maybe it wouldn't be fun or too depressing to write, or they think no one would enjoy reading it. It's clear they want to write darker LIs, but have a personal line drawn.
The other reason I can come up with, as to why they chose that route, is because it helps in creating personal drama. You can love someone and still hate them, after all. Be disgusted with yourself for loving someone you know is manipulating you. Have doubt they actually love you back (which is a fairly justified feeling in this particular story's case).
My impression of the plot is that it's going to be more of a psychological thriller, with the main conflict being of the MC dealing with her situation and the feelings from it. A concentration on the characters versing themselves and each other, rather than them versing an outside force like Atlids. Because of this, I don't think you gonna get what you're hoping for out of this story.
I agree with you that they should try and give the "must love a guy" point a bit stronger a leg to stand on. But I don't believe the writers are gonna remove that plot point, for the reasons above.
I'm simply hoping they can tie it into the world of the story they've built so far. Love doesn't amplify their powers, it activates her power which is to amplify the power of someone else. Who she must love. It just doesn't make sense. It isn't a boost, it is a REQUIREMENT. It would make more sense if it amplified her own ability to amplify powers, that is less... Final. Less absolute, I suppose. The need just isn't there. They can have plenty of personal drama without that requirement, is all I'm saying. Them trying to get her attention and win her affection so they can control her would provide the same drama, without it being a contradictory law that is at odds with the information they've already established. I'm sure they won't change it at all, tbh, I think enough people seem to overlook it and be more interested in their fan service that ultimately it won't matter enough to them. But I would require acknowledgement of how out of place it seems after all their scientific mumbo jumbo to have that be a requirement for her ability.
It was a paragraph in my complaint wall but it's become a big issue, it seems that I was annoyed by the fact that this is just out of place. That I would be annoyed after sitting through scientific explanations and history blurbs and be told that the number of others like the MC could be counted on one hand and then have them know that of the 5 others that have existed, they've all 1) survived long enough to fall in love with some one(Already the odds seem really stacked against you) 2) the people they fell in love with happened to also be quansies and 3) they were able to not only study but confirm that the key to the ability was something as obscure and intangible as love. To clarify, must this also be romantic love? Familial love doesn't count? What about platonic love, what is the definition of this thing that supposedly works? The plot, with this as a catalyst is just not sturdy. I understand why the devs added this, I just don't think it holds up. I don't think it's necessary, I don't see how it fits, I feel it takes away more than it adds. That's all, really. It doesn't make sense. It doesn't make sense within the world presented with the rules that have currently been established.
If they were like "We are trying to understand all of this but we're not sure why this is the way it is." fine, but to have a science session in the middle just to toss it all aside and be like "Yep, for sure love makes this work."... Why? It's kinda... Silly? Even if they were like "we think, love makes this work and we don't know why. It doesn't make sense." that I could scoff at less. As it is, I needed to say something.
I agree with you. If they're going to pursue the romantic love point, they need to make it more harmonious with what they established. A stronger leg to stand on in the story. Honestly, the quickest way to do that would be to increase the number of those like MC (therefore have more studies on them) and have them become rare in the recent era or something.
More info on things as a whole is required, really. I kinda wonder if perhaps there's more in the original script, given that I believe it was translated from Russian. This isn't a slight on the translator, translation is extremely difficult, but there's probably been a loss.
"You can love someone and still hate them, after all. Be disgusted with yourself for loving someone you know is manipulating you."
Oh damn, I hadn't considered that. They can't force her to love them but she also can't force herself to fall out of love once it happens.
I understand that you didn't like the game but it doesn't mean that you had to be such a mean ass about it. You spent so much time writing these long comments full of hatred and mockery. Do you really think this attitude of yours will help the devs to improve their project?
If you want to be helpful to the devs at least be more respectful with your words. Or do you feel good insulting other people's work? Does it make you feel more important?
I literally just created this account so that I could tell you how impressed I am. I've read countless demos and full novels here but NONE of them had me so hooked.
First thing's first: The art is simply gorgeous! From CGS, to background art, to character sprites! Everything's so nicely done. I'm in awe!
The boys! Ah, the boys! I had so much fun discovering bits and pieces of each and every one of them. They're all colorful, unique and despite of their ulterior motives I can't help but feel drawn to them.
I'm a sucker for boys with white hair and bitchy attitude so it's no suprise that Vincent is already my favorite.
The music is great! Really helps to get into the intense, sometimes-humorous and dark atmosphere. I hope you plan on releasing the soundtrack as well. Do you have a source where we can enjoy the music atm?
And lastly, I hope the MC's appearance is customizable. Like I said before, I've read lots of VNs and I'm really tired playing the brown haired, brown eyed, clueless MCs that VNs like to present. I think it'd even better if we don't get to see her at all. It'd give the player more freedom in creating their own MCs without the limitations.
It's pretty obvious you guys spent a lot of time and effort making this awesome novel and I hope you receive all the love and attention you deserve. I can't wait for the full release! ♡
Oh! It's incredible! To receive such a hot response! The joyful cries of our team you can hear even at home, despite the distance!
We are very excited and happy! Thank you, you inspire us with creativity!
To be honest, we're not pretty sure about customizeable MC. Right now we are developing the game where she is not visible or in arts, where we cannot avoid that - she is blurred.
Thanks for evaluating our music, our soul is in there. We are planning to release soundtrack with the game release. Unfortunately, now you cannot find the music anywhere (we hope so) ;)
Again, thank you for your feedback. We need support very much. We hope the full version you'll like at least the same (´｡• ω •｡`)
will this game have a kickstarter because I'm willing to pay such an interesting story and characters, and please if you do make a kickstarter can we have mark as a romanceable love interest? (as a stretch goal or something) I'm already in love!!
Several times re-read your comment. We were so pleased. Our writer and CG artist ran around the room, shouting how happy she is. Thank you very much for your willingness to support the project (´｡• ω •｡`) .
Answering your question: we will not have a kickstarter for this game. The next Acts are probably will not either. We don't want the game release or the amount of content to depend on any external factors, including the funds raised on kickstarter.
We want everything ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ , including Mark as a romanceable character as well, but unfortunately not in this particular game. The money will mainly influence the speed of the game release.
However, MC will have an opportunity to have romantic moments with Mark even in this game.
If you want to help us - rate this game in itch.io. Plus, we will write a separate article on our tumblr page, how Degraman can be supported.
Again, thank yo so much!
Edit: I think my initial comment sounded a bit negative. It was not my intention. I liked the story, music and art. Everything was pretty awesome. But I was set off by not being able to outright tell the guys who acted strange to cool down and give MC some space. Not necessary in an aggressive way. I think it would be to the novel's benefit to add more choices that allow player to react on the situations that look humiliating or inappropriate to them. Like stopping or at least asking Ryu to stop feeding MC. Or kicking/biting/cursing the "sleeping beauty". I know she was immobilized but she could still try to give him a hard time.
I wish you only the best. I think everyone can see how much heart you put into your work. Again the start you made is very impressive. Thank you.
Hmmm...Actually one of the choices in the game was to slap the guy who painted you naked. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Lol. Now I remember. But it was for the touching not for the painting itself. Maybe I just like hitting guys for everything >_< It just felt a bit off not to be able to throw a tantrum for guys acting strange, until Vincent did it.
The guy is a painter. It might be that painting naked people is a casual thing for him). Also he's used seeing people naked because of his abilities. I suppose he doesn't realize anymore that it's actually embarrassing for others). Just my thoughts).
Thank you so much for the feedback! ≧(◕ ‿‿ ◕)≦
There will be much more choices available in the full version. In the first 4 chapters there will be at least four times more choices (by the way, have you reached the 5th Chapter?). In these choices, MC will be able to behave much more versatile towards the guys and the situation in general, than in the demo.
We hope that in the full version the MC's behavior will be closer to you
I'm glad to hear that. I was worried my comment was too hush :( Thank you for your reply.
Yes, I reached the 5th Chapter. And from there I could see that the story is only going to get more interesting. Very exciting! I was surprised, actually, to read in the comments that there was a bad ending somewhere in the 4th Chapter o_O.
With All thanks and appreciation to the creator of the game!!
the demo was captivating, i want to know what happen next ! music and art are beautiful (i only have one issue with the menu which was all in russian, i manage to fing the settings). Great job !
Thanks for your warm words!
And additional thanks for the bugreport, We have fixed it already and refreshed the download links
That's wonderful, that you have played despite the bug
The demo was amazing. Thank you for all the incredible work you, guys, have done. The story looks very interesting and your art style is a masterpiece! It was quite challenging to get a good ending in the 4th chapter - some people might need a walkthrough ;)